More Insight Into 10th and G Church/Condo Project

This is the church that sold its “air rights”, correct? PN Hoffman ain’t stupid, and I’m sure they’ll be able to sell the condos based on the location.

However, while I’m not usually a populist, it seems kind of gross to sit in your luxury condo or lounge by the pool while you watch the huddled masses line up below for something to eat. Should be an interesting social experiment to see just how well these two worlds can coexist in the same space.

I worry the article makes it seem that the status quo is okay!

The hearts of PN Hoffman and the church are in the right place, but they are also very naive. It is an unfortunate fact that many of the homeless served at the church have developed mental illness or are substance abusers–and can be a danger to people walking in the block. I believe in maintaining dignity for those in unfortunate curcumstances and are homeless. However, my concern is for those who are mentally ill, not taking their medications, and who are only loosely monitored by social service providers. The community in our area – residents, businesses, developers, religious and cultural organizations – need to band together to find a comprehensive solution for the homeless and mentally ill on our streets. It has been accomplished successfully in other world-class cities. Until we reach a better situation in DC, I would not endorse anyone living at 10th and G. I found this article in the WaPo provides a false sense of security and anyone who is city savy knows what I mean–the article is preying on those who are naive about living in the district and who would buy a condo there. The article, the developers and the church are doing a disservice by creating a diversion rather than focusing on solving the problems in helping the homeless and mentally ill.

I have seen the plans for the new building — it is quite impressive with lots of curved glass, metal and many “green” features. The church will have a wonderful space with modern facilities and sanctuary.

My only concern is the soup kitchen aspect. As a resident of the Mather across the street, I have seen an increase in the number of homeless hanging around MLK, and an increased level of hostility among the homeless towards passerbys and property (urinating on sidewalks, cooking on steam grates, uprooting bushes for sleeping space). I hope that the new facility, along with a revised plan for the MLK building will help to create new spaces for these displaced people, where they can get the services they need.

A new library is being planned for the old convention center site. What is the plan for the MLK building? Why is it necessary to have the soup kitchen in that site? Not an attractive offer to me. What will the tax structure be like for the condo. All to strange for me. A house of worship in a condo buidling where non of the condo owners are members – weird.

here’s to hoping mixed-use like this happens more often. Interested to see how it will all work out, but enough with passing off the retail-condo mixed use formula as the best thing around when we really need TRUE mized-use (culture, income, etc) for our urban places to be great.

I think this is a great idea, and I also share the views of one anonymous poster that we need to address the situation of mentally ill homeless people who are living on the streets of our neighborhood. I am strongly in favor of mixed use projects in Penn Quarter that combine living and community service space — whether social service, arts, theater, libraries, whatever. So I have no problem with running a soup kitchen on the ground floor of a building that also has condos, and I would certainly consider buying a place in this project if I loved the apartment. I am concerned, though, about volatile, mentally ill people living on our streets, and about the increase in filth that some of our homeless neighbors are creating. Some homeless neighbors have moved in directly underneath the windows of apartments on 7th Street, and I wonder if the stench I pick up when I walk past their living areas wafts up into the apartments above them. We need bathroom facilities that can be used by people living on the streets — that’s why there are so many people at the MLK Library, I think. Anyway, I think PN Hoffman and First Congo are to be congratulated for this effort.

Another big problem that goes along with the homeless population at the shelter is the drugs. There is an open-air drug market in front of the church and library. That is a major safety issue. People high on drugs are crazier than the plain old mentally ill folks.

And, why don’t the police do more about this? All you have to do is stand and observe for a few minutes and you’re bound to see drugs and money change hands. It’s ridiculous.

This will be an interesting experiment. I typically avoid walking that stretch of g street primarily because of the people loitering on the east side of the church not to mention the odor, garbage, etc. I know it’s is a very non-pc, elitist thing to say, but I couldn’t imagine having to walk through that several times a day to get to and from home, and certainly wouldn’t at $500,000. PN Hoffman always struck me as a very crafty developer so im sure they must have an idea of how to make this work so everybody gets what they want.

The 8 trailers at 4th and L will host the losers that loiter in front of that church. PN Hoffman knows what the plan is. You expect them to openly discuss the options? Who’s being naive now?

To Anonymous posting at 7:47, those are temp shelters, see “Life in Mount Vernon Square”
Shelters at 4th & L, NW
http://lifein.mountvernonsquare.org/index.cfm/2006/12/18/Shelters-at-4th–L-NW

“host the losers that loiter” hmmm, who’s being the loser now?

Why are so many afraid of the mentally ill and homeless? Compassion is more than lip service…

It’s all well and good to want to pull together a comprehensive plan to deal with drug treatment, counseling, and job training. Problem is that SCOTUS has consistently ruled that you can’t force the mentally ill to take medication or recieve therapy unless they have been ruled a threat to themselves and others. As far as drug treatment goes, you don’t just go to therapy and come out clean. It’s a continuing process of treatment, followed by lapses, followed by more treatment. And as for job training, construction teams have for years set aside positions and job training for the homeless. Almost all of those positions remain vacant, because most of the homeless who actually show up to recieve training give up after a few hours. They can make more money easier begging on the street. You can’t force them to get treatment and training, you can’t arrest them unless they’re breaking the law. So long as there’s a free meal and guilt-ridden fools giving them spare change, the homeless will be a permanent part of the local scene.

From what I understand, the homeless are FED at the church and it is NOT a shelter. As you might now, homeless are actually BUSSED to and from the church from shelters around the District. Once they are bussed in and fed in the morning, the homeless are then left to wander (pan handle, loiter, use the library) until they are fed later in the day. I think some might consider this arrangement to be a nuisance to the neighborhood because they are essentially leaving (some might say dumping) them on the streets with nothing to do. Why must the neighborhood residents (and businesses) be their hosts each day?

Also, to the anonymous poster who wrote “Why are so many afraid of the mentally ill and homeless? Compassion is more than lip service…” – first of all, we are a compassionate society that pays a lot of taxes to help care for the unfortunate, and we should expect a better outcome for what we are paying; second, I have a feeling you or someone you care for has never been assaulted by a mentally ill homeless person. Do not judge!

If PNHoffman wants to sell condos above the church — I say — more power to you. They know the market, and the building will be amazing. Will the church ever disband the kitchen program? No — it is part of their mission and they are adamant about continuing in their new space. I wonder how the CIA feels about the entrance to the soup kitchen across the street from their front door.

I know the homeless situation on G Street (and the rest of the city ) is an emotional, touchy and difficult situation.

Yes, I hate that the “homeless express” drops off every morning in front of the church, essentially dumping the industries of panhandling by intimidation and (not so) illicit drug dealing into an ever-changing neighborhood.

Every day I walk my dog past the church, I have to deal with pushy men and women who often feel that need to verbally accost me or my dog. Last week, I got so fed up, I yelled back (I know, two wrongs don’t make a right), but when one man was upset that I let the dog poop on the church plaza, I had to retort “At least I clean up his s*it and don’t leave for others to deal with.” I know — not the most clever comeback.

That corner has been a hotbed of hostility for some time. My neighbor, another Mather resident, was accosted by a homeless man last summer, and was punched in the face. She needed surgery to restore her appearance, and she has never felt safe walking west on G Street since.

Another friend was verbally assaulted by a homeless woman and her three children last month, and was ridiculed for his appearance and sexuality.

My ex-partner was slapped by a homeless woman in September outside the Mather when he left the building.

When I first moved into the Mather (3 years ago), I befriended a homeless man (Gary) because I needed to feel safe on my street at night. For $20 a month, he made sure no one messed with me or people with me. During one conversation with him, Gary told me that he made close to $250 a day — CASH — which adds to a yearly take of more than $80,000 — tax free. Adjusted, thats a 6-figure salary! Yes, he spends a great deal of it on drugs, but he also winters in Florida with a bunch of his homeless pals to panhandle in the warm weather.

Do I want the homeless gone? That’s not going to happen. Do I want them to have access to better services, and not a lunch here and a bathroom there? Yes. Why is the shelter in which they sleep not providing daytime activities? Is the homeless bus dropping off in other locations, also?

to 10:52:

we can’t just pay our way out of dealing with the homeless and mentally ill. Sorry, but we don’t pay a lot of taxes to care for them (human services gets very little money these days). However, there are excellent services in this city –most are privately funded.

BIG issue: We have no mental health hospitals! so where should they go? not in your neighborhood?

Perhaps PN Hoffman has some kind of plan in mind to facilitate the mixing of different people, with different needs. We will see in time.

I have not been assaulted, maybe that would change my view… but I know these people are a real and present part of my life downtown. Turning my back on them in disdain just seems wrong… I don’t want to live like that.

Ah me, homelessness is such a complicated issue. It’s true that many “homeless” people make good money on the streets; some even drive in from the suburbs each morning! But there’s also the mentally ill homeless, the drug dealing/doing homeless, the homeless families, and many other faces of homelessness. To try to solve the problem with one approach (more police, more services, whatever) just won’t take care of all the problems.

All that said, the homeless population at 10th & G can be particularly nasty. Maybe it’s our neighborhood’s rapid gentrification that has caused so much hostility? Like others who have posted here, I’ve learned my lesson and don’t walk down the north side of G Street between 9th & 10th.

However, after yesterday’s WaPo, PN Hoffman probably has a waiting list of people with the necessary funds and liberal guilt to buy a place in this new development. (And it’s at the not-so-Secret Service’s front door, not the CIA’s.)

UGH, if you cannot stand the sight of homeless people- then maybe you should move back to Ashburn VA. Besides that people have right- they have just as much right as you to sit or stand on a sidewalk. What a sickening thought- a society that does not permit people to sit or stand on public space provided for all. PN Hoffman is not dumb as another poster said- accordingly I will say it’s going to work! As for the idea that they are causing trouble- well call the police and contact your ANC Rep. When I moved to Shaw years ago that is what I did.

To the Anonymous poster at 6:28 pm:

Why would you not want to find a way to make this a better city with a healthier and more caring population? I think nobody should be so callous as to stand the sight of the homeless. It is an abomination that things are so bad in DC while other cities around the world have found ways to improve many of the ills of society. Why do you expect so little from your government?

There are too many lines of discussion here to respond to, so I’ll limit myself to the last Anonymous poster, 12/28 at 10:41 pm. First, exactly which city or cities have been able to improve the situation so much better than DC? It seems to me that many of these “improvements” are more an ability to find places to hide the problems rather than solve them. Also, and most importantly, why are you expecting the government to solve your problems? Are you out there helping those in need? Or at the very least, are you giving financial assistance to those nonprofits in DC that already exist that are making significant impacts?

I am the Anonymous poster from 12/28 at 10:41 pm.

The problems I expect government to fix are not mine (I am not homeless or mentally ill). The problems belong to our collective society, and they are generally the result of our culture and economic system – and therefore, the government is the only way to successfully address such systematic problems. Since I am not particularly wealthy, I do not contribute as much as I would like to nonprofits. However, I contribute my income tax and property taxes to the District government–probably around $10,000 per year. That’s a lot of money. I think my hard work earning a living means I am contributing to our society. Am I personally on the front line helping out those in need? No, I leave helping severerely mentally ill and chemically dependent people to those trained in social services, a very honorable and difficult job. Am I advocating for the District to get off its butt, develop a plan, use some of our $1 billion surplus and help people for real – yes!

I have repeatedly been told that other cities have been able to work together and find better solutions – including Toronto, London and Chicago.

As much as I belive in and appreciate nonprofits, only the force of government can bring comprehensive change. For example, developing a new and more welcomg psychiatric hospital than St. Elizabeth’s, that the mentally ill would actually be willing to enter? I am not an expert on what to do, but I know the status quo is an embarrassment to the District. I often hear we are judged by how we treat the people with the greatest problems. I believe the government needs to act to get the biggest impact.

Oh, and which nonprofits do you feel are making significant impacts?

I agree with much of what the anonymous poster of 12?29, 3:04 p.m. wrote. We can, and must, do better and we should expect and demand that the DC government deliver comprehensive services for chronically mentally ill people who live here, whether they live on the streets, in shelters, or have permanent housing. Mental illness is often life-ruining, and it is alway life altering, for those who are afflicted by it. No one signs up to be mentally ill, any more than anyone signs up to have cancer. Yes, there are healthier ways of living that can prevent the onset of some diseases, but I’ve never heard of any measures that prevent mental illness. Any one of us could develop mental illness, at any time. Think about what it would be like to lose touch with reality, to be terribly frightened, all of the time, to be addicted to substances because they provide some measure of soothing, to lose relationships, jobs, housing….these are catastrophic events, just as catastrophic as earthquakes and hurricanes. In our neighborhood, we have a lot of homeless, chronically mentally ill neighbors. They bring challenges, for sure. But no challenge they may pose — whether to our physical security, enjoyment of our neighborhood, whatever — begins to approach the challenges each of them face each and every day. It is simply unacceptable that people with serious illness do not have a host of options that are far more attractive than living on the streets. I believe the reason they live on the streets is because the alternatives are far worse, in their minds and probably in an absolute sense. So I agree with anonymous that we must expect and demand compassionate services from our government. And I also believe that each one of us needs to step outside of our personal comfort zones to put a human face on caring, to volunteer, to donate money, to take action. There are a million opportunities to volunteer. And even if none of them ultimately bring about the big change we need, we have an obligation as human beings to be kind to one another, and to bring a bit of kindness into the day of someone who is suffering a torment that we should, every day, thank our lucky stars not to share.

Enough of your babbling. If you care so dearly about the homeless that harass and accost innocent passerbys on a regular basis, then invite them into your home so they can squat and deficate on your rug while assaulting you. Only yesterday I was walking by the infamous homeless shelter and saw a man doing just that on the street. I quickly averted my gaze but was still told to “F off cracker before I beat you.” Because I truly understand your love of these wonderful people, please, get them off the streets and invite them in to live with you. It might even get you elected!!

Easy solution: re-criminalize vagrancy and jail/institutionalize them. They get 3 squares a day and a roof. We get them off the street.

I am a formerly homeless individual now involved in advocavy for persons who are homeless. As someone who frequented the soup kitchen in question, I thought you might be interested in my reaction to some of your postings…

“The article, the developers and the church are doing a disservice by creating a diversion rather than helping the homeless and mentally ill.” I couldn’t agree more. Because homelessness has become such a large problem in DC and around the nation (this year over one out of every 100 people in the US will experience homelessness) the focus has been toward managing the population rather than solving the problems which cause homelessness.

“I hope that the new facility will help to create new spaces for these displaced people, where they can get the services they need.” Unfortunately, while the soup kitchen will reopen after construction, the services provided by the Downtown DC BID at that location will no longer exist. We are currently working with the city to move those services to another location.

“I am concerned about volatile, mentally ill people living on our streets…” While there are cases of individuals with mental illness, housed or otherwise, commiting acts of violence, the mentally ill population is no more likely, percentage-wise, than the general population to commit acts of violence, and is many times more likely than the general population to be a victim of such violence.

“There is an open-air drug market in front of the church and library. That is a major safety issue.” This is very true, and also exists in front of every major shelter in DC, but the danger primarily comes from the dealers, who usually aren’t homeless themselves, not the users.
If we don’t do something to keep drug dealers away from homeless service centers, individuals who have drug issues will have no chance at recovery.

“We are a compassionate society that pays a lot of taxes to help care for the unfortunate, and we should expect a better outcome for what we are paying.” The amount of money pumped into homeless services in DC is not as big as you might think, but another problem is what that money is being spent on. With the dollars spent on managing homelessness (shelters, food, emergency room visits, prison stays, etc) we could afford to actually house the 14,000 homeless men, women and children in the DC metro area, and places like Arlington are finally figuring that out.

Jon, I am sorry for your experiences involving the homeless. Discrimination against those with alternate lifestyles (GLBTQ) in the homeless community is a serious problem, especially for homeless GLBTQs. It’s a case of one abused minority group lashing out at another in order to make themselves feel superior to somebody. As for your question, “Why is the shelter in which they sleep not providing daytime activities?” Many shelters in DC operate from 7pm to 7am, and clients who aren’t working or cannot work due to physical or mental disabilities are turned out into the street to fend for themselves until nightfall. This is one policy We are lobbying to change.

“Exactly which city or cities have been able to improve the situation so much better than DC?” San Francisco has had a great deal of success with their plan to end homelessness based on the “Housing First Model,” in which individuals and families who are homeless are placed into housing and then assisted with the issues that landed them in that situation. It’s very difficult to get off drugs, get a decent job, or recover from mental illness in a communal shelter environment.

“For example, developing a new and more welcomg psychiatric hospital than St. Elizabeth’s, that the mentally ill would actually be willing to enter?” The city is planning to construct a new hospital at St Elizabeth’s, but unfortunately it will have half of the beds that the current hospital provides, which is already too small a number.

“Easy solution: re-criminalize vagrancy and jail/institutionalize them. They get 3 squares a day and a roof. We get them off the street.” It costs over three times as much to incarcerate a person as it does to house them.

As one of the posters on this topic, I would like to thank David Pirtle for taking the time to provide answers to some of our comments. This feels like the start of a dialogue; I would hope that this develops further so that Gallery Place can lead in improving the homeless situation and make this a world class neighborhood.
GPLiving – woudl you consider keeping this dialogue open on your web page? I would pose the question to the community: How do we engage all of the players – residents, businesses, developers, government, non-profits,social agencies and the homeless – to push forward a working solution?

David,

” Unfortunately, while the soup kitchen will reopen after construction, the services provided by the Downtown DC BID at that location will no longer exist.”

If they are no longer going to bus people in, will the soup kitchen primarily serve the walk-in homeless community?

After living across from a homeless shelter (centeral union mission) and now around the corner from Franklin Shelter I can honestly say my view on the homeless had changed. There is nothing like getting harassed everyday walking home. I can only hope the city does something about the problem. I am happy to see centeral union mission move and hope Franklin shelter does not become permanant.